“How do you be a Christian in a pagan world?”

Steve Brown:
How do you be a Christian in a pagan world? The answer to that and other questions on Key Life.

Matthew Porter:
Welcome to Key Life. Our host and teacher is Steve Brown. He’s nobody’s guru, but he does have honest answers to hard questions about the Bible. God’s grace changes everything, how we love, work, live, lead, marry, parent, evangelize, and worship. Now, here’s Steve and Pete Alwinson from ForgeTruth with street-smart Bible teaching for real life.

Steve Brown:
Thank you Matthew. Hi Pete.

Pete Alwinson:
Hey Steve, how you doing?

Steve Brown:
I’m doing really good and now really good because you’re here.

Pete Alwinson:
Right. You’ve probably been recording all morning, haven’t you?

Steve Brown:
Yeah, well I have, or at least a part of the morning.

Pete Alwinson:
Yeah.

Steve Brown:
I mean it was great material. Thousands will be saved and hundreds healed.

Pete Alwinson:
It always is, Steve.

Steve Brown:
And if you believe that, you’ll believe anything. But I got through it and it’s over and now we’re recording this afternoon with you. That’s Pete Alwinson and I told you before, and you don’t listen to me, go to ForgeTruth.com that is an absolutely great website. And you can listen to the podcast there. You can pick up great teaching, especially if you’re a guy. And if you’re wondering what your husband is thinking, you might want to check it out too. That’s ForgeTruth.com as you know, Pete comes in every Friday and we spend the entire broadcast answering questions. And we love your questions. You can call 1-800-KEY-LIFE, 24 7, and record your question, and sometimes we put that on the air. You can send your question to

Key Life Network
P.O. Box 5000
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if you live in Canada, it’s

Key Life Canada

P.O. Box 28060

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or you can e-mail your question to [email protected] and in asking your question, we’ll give you an encyclopedic answer, if you include a large contribution to Key Life. Actually, we take your question whether you can contribute or not, seriously. But if you can help us financially, I promise we’ll be faithful with your gift, as faithful as you were in the giving of it. Pete, why don’t you lead us in prayer and then we’ll get to some of these questions.

Pete Alwinson:
Awesome. Awesome. Let’s pray together. Our Great God, what a joy to come into your presence today at the end of the week to stop just for a couple of minutes and to remember that you are the God who made us, the God who redeemed us, the God who sustains us, and you sustain the whole world, Lord. And we honor you and praise you and ask that you would just enable us this week, at the end of this week, to come and worship you. Lord, we thank you for this week. We know you’ve been in charge the whole time, but Lord, we do ask for wisdom to understand what happened to us this week, what we can learn from it. Many of us have trials that we are seeking to grow through, and we ask Holy Spirit that you would give us a clear understanding of how you want us to grow in the midst of those trials. Father, may your name become great in our country and around the world, and the name of Christ be spread abroad through us, and even this week-end, as we worship. And we pray for our pastors and priests and teachers and leaders and worship directors, and we’re so thankful for them and ask that you would use them in a powerful way, to bring the gospel of grace to us in a clear way. So Lord, we commit this time of Q&A to you right now. Thank you for Steve and all those at Key Life who do so much behind the scenes. We pray these things in Jesus’ strong Name. Amen.

Steve Brown:
Amen. Let’s first go to our phone lines.

Caller 1:
I’m from Rhode Island, too. I heard you and Pete talking, and the guy from Rhode Island. What he stated to you was true, and it was the first time I heard you and Pete give a response that I really just didn’t understand. I think you don’t understand what it’s like in Rhode Island, because the guy’s right. And the only thing that saves you here, as you walk through the valley of the shadow of death, is the Lord. And without him, I wouldn’t have survived either. Through all, through everything, you don’t know what these people are like. And by the way, you said you came from Rhode Island? Or you were in Rhode Island before? It’s a lot different than you remember. And what you and Pete said, talking to people, doing that, you’re going to get yourself, you’re going to get people hurt. That was just not right. You know, that’s my opinion, but I think it’s better to think the opinion of Paul, where he said, sometimes you go to a place, you shake the dust off your feet, and you move on. And I think that would have been a way better answer, because you guys really haven’t been around these places, I guess, in a long time.

Steve Brown:
Well, the problem is, and by the way, you agree with that first guy, because you are the first guy, who called in, and that started the conversation that we had. He said, I live in a very pagan, very un Christian, wealthy, woke area, and I, it’s hard to be a Christian in this kind of place, what do I do? And I don’t think the first line of response is to shake the dust off your feet and go to somebody who wants to hear. Jesus did say that, but he, I mean, that was not, he had some other things like go into all the world and announce the reality of the kingdom. So, you’ve got, and yeah, we’ve been to Rhode Island a lot. I lived in Boston a lot of years. And you spent much of your ministry in New England, too. So, we’ve been there, we’ve done that, and we understand that the name of Jesus is not held high in some quarters. But as a matter of fact, it isn’t held high in some quarters in Orlando, either.

Pete Alwinson:
That’s true. It depends on where you are. You know, one thought that occurred to me is that, it may well be that he’s supposed to go someplace where there are people more receptive to the gospel. Now, I’m not saying he should leave, but maybe God is calling him to go someplace to be an evangelist or move to another city to be more aggressive. On the other hand, what we do see in the New Testament is the early church was told, hey, put your head down, work, provide for your, and be willing to make more money to share with those who are in need. In other words, put your head down and live and live well. And the early church, the interesting thing about the early church, is that they were not trying to be relevant to culture. The early church was just doing their thing. They were worshiping Jesus, celebrating the Lord’s Supper. And picking up babies that have been abandoned by Romans, for instance, and then raising them. And then, and then, when people wanted to come to church, they did not make it easy to become a Christian. They would catechize you for a year, if you wanted, I want to join you. Well, okay, Come to church for a year, we won’t let you into communion. But we’ll teach you for a year and then see, you know, so this idea that we’re, that the early, how do you win people? Jesus wins people in various ways. And so maybe, put your head down and just be the best businessman you can be up there, raise the best family.

Steve Brown:
And I, that is so good. And I would add to that, make a prayer. Lord, if you open up a door, I’ll go through it.

Pete Alwinson:
That’s right.

Steve Brown:
I won’t duck. I mean, I won’t pretend to be something I’m not. So, you open the door and I’ll say something. I don’t want to, but I’m going to say something and you’ll be surprised. You know, more people are open to the gospel than most Christians think.

Pete Alwinson:
Absolutely.

Steve Brown:
Now, we have leaders that aren’t. We have people in power that aren’t.

Pete Alwinson:
That’s right.

Steve Brown:
But the average guy on the street, you would be surprised if he knew you were a Christian and that wasn’t important to you, he’d have some questions.

Pete Alwinson:
I think it’s so good. And speaking of questions, Steve, I think one of the things that we can do and should do in our culture, when people make a dogmatic assertion about something that is true that we think is absolutely immoral. We could say, okay, but let me ask you this. And then start asking them questions about the logical outcomes of their position. Engage them and get, why would you say that a 10 year old child has the right, for instance, to decide, what they’re going to do with their own body in terms of chemicals put into it, or whatever. We need to engage people. I’m interested, why would you think that way? We can undermine their thinking. And the early church out thought and outlived everybody else.

Steve Brown:
They really did. And created questions and those questions Peter said be ready to answer.

Pete Alwinson:
That’s right.

Steve Brown:
And so create, and listen, we’re not making fun of you, you’re in a hard place. And we know that, but it’s going to be increasingly so in our country, and I don’t think we can run.

Pete Alwinson:
That’s right.

Steve Brown:
I don’t think we can shake the dust off our feet, eventually maybe, but not at the beginning, because we are here for them. And that’s good, I’m glad you called back.

Pete Alwinson:
I am too.

Steve Brown:
Good question.

Pete Alwinson:
I am too.

Steve Brown:
What are your beliefs and denomination? That’s an e-mail. What are you?

Pete Alwinson:
What are you?

Steve Brown:
I’m a Bapterian.

Pete Alwinson:
A Bapterian.

Steve Brown:
No, actually.

Pete Alwinson:
You believe in Baptists in a

Steve Brown:
Well, I’m kind of a mix. I had so many Baptists that had an effect on my life.

Pete Alwinson:
Yeah.

Steve Brown:
People like John DeBrine. And that, I’m not willing to go and be a Baptist, but listen, a Bapterian maybe, I’ll start a new denomination.

Pete Alwinson:
You should.

Steve Brown:
You can be the Bishop. And I’ll be the assistant Bishop.

Pete Alwinson:
The church of what’s happening now.

Steve Brown:
Yeah, are Bapterians.

Pete Alwinson:
Yeah, I mean, Bapterians are not bad.

Steve Brown:
Pete and I are both Presbyterians.

Pete Alwinson:
But not necessarily of the mainline quality of the Westminster Confession of Faith.

Steve Brown:
Yeah, we’re a part of PCA, which is a fairly small denomination, and we’re reformed in our theological beliefs. We really believe that God is sovereign, and we would accept the tenets of the Westminster Confession of Faith and the larger and shorter catechisms. And as I’ve said often, Pete and I, neither one would suggest that you have to be a Presbyterian in order to get to heaven, but then why take a chance?

Pete Alwinson:
Yeah, I know, right?

Steve Brown:
It’s a joke. Don’t, don’t send us letters.

Pete Alwinson:
Oh, man.

Steve Brown:
Let me see if I can get a yes or no question. Does the Bible actually teach election?

Pete Alwinson:
Yes.

Steve Brown:
And it also teaches responsibility.

Pete Alwinson:
Yes, that’s right.

Steve Brown:
And if you can fit those together, let’s get together, write a book. And we will make a fortune. The Bible really does teach both of those things.

Pete Alwinson:
It really does. It really does. And so, there’s subtle nuances in understanding that. Just keep reading the New Testament, keep reading the Bible.

Steve Brown:
Do as much as you can what it says.

Pete Alwinson:
Yeah.

Steve Brown:
When you don’t, you’ll be forgiven and God will use it.

Pete Alwinson:
Oh, man. That’s right. God’s Word is great. Just keep diving in.

Steve Brown:
Do you know, we are really Greeks. We’re Aristotelian in our thinking. And that means the principle of non contradiction. But there is a sense in which the teachings of the Bible don’t fit into a nice little pattern.

Pete Alwinson:
That’s true.

Steve Brown:
They’re a lot more complicated, and when we get home, we’ll have the one who dreamed it up explain it to us, but by then it won’t matter.

Pete Alwinson:
Ah, that would be great.

Steve Brown:
Hey, we’ve got to go too. But before leaving, let me say. Key Life is a listener supported production of Key Life Network.