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“In the incarnation, did Jesus know about us?”

“In the incarnation, did Jesus know about us?”

JUNE 7, 2024

/ Programs / Key Life / “In the incarnation, did Jesus know about us?”

Steve Brown:
In the Incarnation, did Jesus know about us? The answer to that and other questions on Key Life.

Matthew Porter:
If you think laughter isn’t spiritual, or that faithfulness to God means conformity to Christian stereotypes, then this program probably isn’t for you. But if you’re looking for honest Biblical answers to hard questions, then welcome to Key Life. Here’s our host, author and seminary professor, Steve Brown, along with Pete Alwinson from ForgeTruth.

Steve Brown:
Thank you Matthew. Hi Pete.

Pete Alwinson:
Steve, happy Friday, man. How you doing?

Steve Brown:
I’m doing, I’m doing really good, as a matter of fact.

Pete Alwinson:
And you look good, too.

Steve Brown:
I know.

Pete Alwinson:
You look ready to go.

Steve Brown:
I know. And it shouldn’t be true. I should be dead. You know, I went to my cardiologist last week. And he always, he’s really good, and I go to him every six months to check me out. And he examines me thoroughly, and he looks, always looks sour. And I turned to his intern, who was standing there, and I said, he’s always disappointed when he can’t find anything wrong with me. And she laughed, and he even smiled, which was great, but he can’t believe it. He says it’s genes, And I say it’s Jesus, and he’s not a believer, but the last time he said, well, maybe a little bit of both. You’re looking great, too.

Pete Alwinson:
I love it.

Steve Brown:
That’s because you run 800 miles a day, you get on that bike and you climb mountains. I don’t do any of that. I should be dead.

Pete Alwinson:
We’re just doing the best we can, by the grace of God, you know.

Steve Brown:
That’s Pete Alwinson. Be sure and check out ForgeTruth.com there is an incredible podcast on that website and it’ll blow you away. Go check it out. It’s interesting and it’s fun and there’s a bunch of other stuff. And if you live in Central Florida, you ought to be involved in Forge. You’re increasing, your tribe is increasing and that’s a good thing.

Pete Alwinson:
It’s a good thing.

Steve Brown:
We started one, a Forge at our church. And I told them not to, but they insisted and they’re a bunch of men that are meeting. So, check that out on the website. As you know, Pete comes in and we answer questions together. And we’ve done that for years. You can get an answer to your question simply by picking up the phone and dialing 1-800-KEY-LIFE and following instructions. Sometimes we put your voice on the air. Or if you would prefer, you can send your question to

Key Life Network
P.O. Box 5000
Maitland, Florida 32794

in Canada, it’s

Key Life Canada
P.O. Box 28060
Waterloo, Ontario N2L 6J8

and by the way, while I’m mentioning Canada, Joy, we appreciate you guys being on with us now. That’s a new radio station, and it’s a great one. Or you can send your questions to [email protected] and if you can help us financially, please do. That would be the places where you could do it. If you don’t, you’re going to get the hives. How’s that for manipulative?

Pete Alwinson:
Yeah, very.

Steve Brown:
Actually, we understand that most people are not able to help us financially, but if you do, we will appreciate it, and we will squeeze every dime for the glory of God. And if you can’t or don’t feel led to, do say a prayer for this ministry. Pete, why don’t you pray for us, and then we’ll turn to some of these questions.

Pete Alwinson:
You got it. Let’s pray together. Our Great Father, what a joy to come to you at the end of this week and to give you honor and praise and glory. We do lift up your holy name. You are majestic. You are Spirit. You are Triune, Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. You are holy and good and kind and merciful and just. You teach us. You’re patient to us. You deserve all of our praise and glory. And when we think of who you are sometimes, Lord, we are just stunned. And we pray this week-end that our pastors and priests and teachers and leaders and worship directors and all those who have been working hard to bring us into your presence would be ready to go and that you’d use them in a glorious way to bring us one step deeper or one step closer to your glory. Now, we just commit this time of Q&A to you. Lord, we love you because you first loved us. And we ask that you would sharpen our minds and our hearts. In Jesus’ name we pray. Amen.

Steve Brown:
Amen. Pete, let’s go to our phone lines.

Caller 1:
When he was on the cross and he forgave the people that crucified him and they didn’t repent, did he know they were going to repent later?

Steve Brown:
Well them and us, I guess. You know, when you go, Jesus probably knew which ones would, and which ones wouldn’t, but maybe he didn’t, maybe in the Incarnation. Because he limited himself in order that he might not play games in the Incarnation, in a number of instances. But he probably, if he wanted to know, knew the ones that would and the ones that wouldn’t. But more important than that, he knew about you, and he knew about me. He prayed for us in the high priestly prayer, didn’t he?

Pete Alwinson:
Yeah. That is so true. And even before that, when you go back to John 6, there are those tantalizing. He said, you didn’t choose me, I chose you. So, yeah, I think you have to see it as individuals that he did know us by name and by face.

Steve Brown:
That’s so true. And that’s kind of cool. You know, not only did he know, he knew it from the moment of Creation.

Pete Alwinson:
That’s right. That’s right.

Steve Brown:
Which is kind of a big deal.

Pete Alwinson:
What you brought up is that challenge of the kenosis in Philippians chapter 2 where he limited himself and sometimes, and in the gospel, sometimes we see him limiting himself

Steve Brown:
and sometimes not

Pete Alwinson:
he knows what was in man. And so, it’s really, it’s going to be fun to discover all that.

Steve Brown:
Oh, it is. And it’s, and by the way, it’s a lot more complicated than we think.

Pete Alwinson:
That’s right.

Steve Brown:
And it’s a lot more complicated than we can think. It really is. God’s bigger. You know, the reason I think a lot of things don’t happen in the church is because we worship a little God and little gods do little things.

Pete Alwinson:
That’s right.

Steve Brown:
And we put him in a box. And if he doesn’t fit exactly where he goes, then we say it’s heresy, when as a matter of fact, God is so much bigger.

My thoughts are not your thoughts. Neither my ways, your ways. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are my ways higher than your ways and my thoughts than your thoughts.

Which means

Pete Alwinson:
That’s so true.

Steve Brown:
Oh, it is. And sometimes just thinking about that, looking at the attributes of a sovereign God can be a wonderful way to do your devotional time. Just contemplating good. You’ll say, wow. And then you’ll say it backwards, wow. This is an e-mail question. Do you think it is Biblical or within God’s will to pray for God to save someone? And then a second part of the question, can I pray for a financial independence?

Pete Alwinson:
Yeah, I think yes to both. I think you can pray for financial independence, but don’t think that what God wants you to not do is to work. It’s a part of how we’re wired, right?

Steve Brown:
So true. And we live in a culture where work is no longer valued in some quarters.

Pete Alwinson:
That is so true. It’s so true. That’s a profound statement as we see sort of that trust the government mentality and just depend on everybody else. But work is part of our purpose.

Steve Brown:
It really is.

Pete Alwinson:
And God is a worker. We don’t find our identity in work, we do our work out of our identity as the deeply beloved sons and daughters.

Steve Brown:
And do it with excellence.

Pete Alwinson:
That’s right.

Steve Brown:
Efficiency.

Pete Alwinson:
Yeah. Yeah.

Steve Brown:
Obedience.

Pete Alwinson:
Yeah.

Steve Brown:
Recognition of authority, producing what God is pleased is produced. That’s all a part of, you know, Labor Day used to be a time when we lauded all of those values.

Pete Alwinson:
That’s right. That’s right.

Steve Brown:
But we don’t much anymore.

Pete Alwinson:
I know.

Steve Brown:
There is a generation, and I don’t want to be just an old guy complaining, because in some ways they’re better than we are. But there’s this, where you’d rather stay home than go to work, that you’d rather play computer games than you would to produce a product, that you would rather work 10 hours a week than 40 hours a week, and as a result we lose something very, very important.

Pete Alwinson:
Very important. You know, I just finished a book called The Genius of Israel about, that author wrote a previous book called The Startup Nation. And in Israel, more startups than in than any other country in the world, which is absolutely amazing, how small it is.

Steve Brown:
I know.

Pete Alwinson:
And so, he made this, one guy makes a statement, he says, you know, people come to the Holy Land to see what happened in the past. Even more so now they’re coming to see what’s happening in the future. And we ought to be those people as Christians who are helping to tend the culture and expand and provide work. Yes, but provide innovation as well.

Steve Brown:
Good comment. We’ll get to the saved part in a minute, but I know how much you love Israel. How do you feel about what’s going on?

Pete Alwinson:
Well, yeah. I mean, we’re, it’s a tragedy of major proportions, of course. I don’t see how they have any option, but to go ahead and try to eradicate.

Steve Brown:
I think they’re going to do that.

Pete Alwinson:
Hamas.

Steve Brown:
I really do. I really believe there’s a supernatural element in this. And as horrible as it is, I think war settles things. And I think it’s going to settle it here too on Israel’s behalf and it’s going to make a lot of people angry. Deal with it. They are really connected with God in a special way. All right, the second part of the question. Can I pray for somebody to get saved?

Pete Alwinson:
You know, I would say yes, but it’s interesting how what we see Paul praying for more than anything else is like open doors for the gospel, open opportunities. And we don’t see him really praying for individuals by name, but that certainly can’t be a wrong thing to do.

Steve Brown:
No, it can’t. You know, we prayed for, I prayed for my father for years. I presented the gospel to him. He didn’t think he was good enough and he ignored it. And I believe that the prayers of my mother and my brother and me for our father and husband were not unconnected to the fact that he became a Christian.

Pete Alwinson:
That’s right. That’s right.

Steve Brown:
I really believe that.

Pete Alwinson:
I think you’re right. And we have a high level police officer that came to Christ recently and comes to Forge now. Every week, I’ve been praying for him for about three or four years.

Steve Brown:
And I don’t, you know, I don’t think that was wasted. I think we know about God’s sovereignty and all of that. But maybe he listened to your prayers at Creation. And maybe he applied them for my father and your friend before we were ever born. That’s kind of mind blowing too.

Pete Alwinson:
Back to how big God is.

Steve Brown:
We’ve got to go because we’re little. And Key Life is a listener supported production of Key Life Network.

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